Wednesday, October 26, 2005

Baalei Tshuvah issues

Good discussion in the Canadian Jewish News :

...A host of other questions also arise: Do baalei tshuvah tend to remain overly or exclusively attached to the institutions that may have nurtured their initial interest in Judaism and subsequent growth? Does this attachment hinder their religious growth in any way? From a psychological perspective, how do baalei tshuvah contend with the different parts of their experience (their life before versus their life after, so to speak).
But perhaps the most challenging issue, from an educational point of view, pertains to the children of baalei tshuvah. Recently, Rabbi Yaacov Haber, the former national director of Jewish education for the Orthodox Union, wrote that the challenge of being a member of the second generation can lead to grave problems. Some even end up rejecting the very lifestyle their parents struggled so hard to attain, often with a disdainful retort such as, You rejected your upbringing, now its my turn. Often the baal tshuvah remains quite alone to handle these dilemmas, caught between their Orthodox co-religionists and their secular relatives who, respectively, either can't relate to the problem or may not see it as a problem at all...

And they sadly have a hard time with shidduchim.
posted by Yeshiva Orthodoxy
at 10:50 PM


Anonymous Mycroft said...


12:27 AM  
Blogger Yeshiva Orthodoxy said...

Yichus is a powerful force.
One's individual Yichus is even more powerful, and relevant.

12:45 AM  
Blogger Passionate Life said...

A powerful force to discriminate and meaningless if they don’t have basic middos to know not to discriminate against a frum Jew from ANY background.

The list in the Torah of our great leaders who completely disregarded yichus goes on and on.

Moshe Rabbenuie married the daughter of Yisroi who was an idol worshiping priest before he converted.

Shamay and Avtalion were converts or children of converts and were from greatest leaders in Klal Yisroel. People would follow them on Yom Kippur rather than the Cohen Gadol serving in the Beis Hamikdosh!

Inkelos was a roman solider without Yichus, yet he is worthy to be printed in the Chumash.

Boaz who was the Gadol Hador married Ruth who was the daughter of the Moeb, one of the worst nations in history.

We all know Rabbi Akiva’s history as well as that he married (the second time) a Ger.

Using Yichus as an excuse to not marry a Bal Tshuva or a Ger is the most anti-Torah concept out there.

3:23 AM  
Blogger Yeshiva Orthodoxy said...

So when it says "a Man should marry a daughter of a talmid chachim", it means what?

12:51 PM  
Blogger Alan said...

It's very nice that there is a Rabbinic statement that one should marry the daughter of a Talmid hakham. Recognize that the Sages, while wise, were not perfect-- they had their own beliefs, and while their laws are binding, their beliefs are not.

I assume you would agree, unless you decide to follow their medical advice and take their declarations as normative science.

Your description of yichus should be more specific than calling it a “powerful force.” What does that mean? Powerful to whom? God? People?

11:31 PM  
Blogger Yeshiva Orthodoxy said...

No one comes close to understand genetics and the like.
I do believe and feel there is an esoteric attachment we all have with our dead kin.
That means something.
Not everything.

11:45 PM  
Blogger Alan said...

I am sorry, but unlike much of your commentary on your weblog, your comments on yichus are still far too vague-- I cannot even offer comment upon them, because you haven't made a real claim that can be properly evaluated.

1:15 AM  
Blogger Yeshiva Orthodoxy said...

"..are still far too vague"

I think there is something to be said about:
good genes,
come from an honorable family.

How much weight to put on them. it is hard to say.

2:21 PM  
Blogger Alan said...

Ceterus paribus, I agree. Of course, this is common sense, not necessarily implicit and central to Torah (even if some of the Sages may have mentioned it).

But, yes, if I had to choose between two identical women, one of whom had a better family and gene structure, I'd choose that one.

At the same time, your comments hardly seem congruous with your initial words that "Yichus is a powerful force. One's individual Yichus is even more powerful, and relevant." I'm also curious as to what yichus there is aside from one's individual yichus. Your terminology bordered on the metaphysical.

12:49 AM  
Blogger Yeshiva Orthodoxy said...

I believe there is metaphysical aspect to yichus.
Everyone's Ancestor's good deeds (and possibly bad)remain hovering on to his prodigy.

1:41 PM  

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